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Old Aug 13, 2003 | 05:54 AM
  #11  
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Dont get a bolt action.. That's old school. Get a semi-auto and if you dont like that then a pump.
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Old Aug 15, 2003 | 06:48 PM
  #12  
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Originally posted by madlow
Dont get a bolt action.. That's old school. Get a semi-auto and if you dont like that then a pump.
Whyz that? In a sniper/hunting situation, you can probably assume that you will only get one shot to make your kill. In this case the semi-auto isn't going to offer any distinct advantage. If you're going for "two in the chest, one in the head" you'll be doing that a closer range and you'll want a semi-auto assault rifle, not a sniper rifle. For the end use we're talking about here, the bolt action is more than enough.
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Old Aug 15, 2003 | 07:09 PM
  #13  
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I hear you can get a >80% M1 for around 500, iron sights of course but.... its gUOT shieeet mang
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Old Aug 15, 2003 | 09:24 PM
  #14  
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I orderd a AK-15 bushmaster.
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Old Aug 15, 2003 | 11:20 PM
  #15  
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Originally posted by Smurf
I orderd a AK-15 bushmaster.
AK-15? or AR-15?

Going for the assault rifle...cool. Them's illegal in California.
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Old Aug 16, 2003 | 12:46 AM
  #16  
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Ok, first off, what is the goal here? You say you want a sniper rifle. I seriously doubt you hunt snipe (look it up) so I am guessing you want a rifle for the modern definition of sniping. Shooting people = not cool. A target rifle and a sniper rifle are two different things, and if you walk into a gun shop asking for a sniper rifle a lot of them will tell you to shop elsewhere.
Originally posted by azn_redneck
you'll want a semi-auto assault rifle, not a sniper rifle.
Sorry, but you've been brainwashed.

There is no such thing as a semi automatic assault rifle. One of the basic qualifying features of an assault rifle is select fire capability. Yes, it is important. The correct term in this case is "semi-automatic carbine."
Originally posted by Smurf
I orderd a AK-15 bushmaster.
There is no such thing as an AK-15. Since Bushmaster is famous for their versions of the Fairchild/Armalite AR-15, I'll take it you mean their model of AR-15 with the AK-74 pattern muzzle brake.

I have never been a fan of the AR pattern, I can't trust a rifle that had so many issues in its early versions. Also, the fact that the receivers are made out of aluminum isn't really confidence inspiring. The light 5.56mm NATO cartridge is too light for long range work, while the velocity is good, the average 5.56mm bullet weighs between 55 and 62 grains. Wind deflection is a significant factor here. At 100 yards though, the AR-15 will shoot sub-MOA all day long as long as its not too windy.

For a nice target rifle, I would have suggested a Remington 700 in 300 Win. Mag.

For a sniper rifle, I would have suggested a Romanian FPK (7.62x54mm Rimmed.) They are imported under the name "Romak III." That is my personal preference, however an H&K PSG-1 (7.62x51mm NATO) or a Remington 700 PSS (police only, 7.62x51mm NATO) may serve you better. The FPK is the cheapest of the three, however.

For a cheap, accurate rifle just get a No.4 Mk.I or Mk.II Lee-Enfield (.303 British.) Check to see if the barrel is still free-floating, sand the stock if not. Go to the range and have fun. If you want a more modern cartridge, get a surplus Turkish Mauser and have it rebarreled. Drill/tap and mount a scope, then you have a cheap sporterized rifle that takes standard ammunition. I won't give my standard "don't sporterize" speach here, because I doubt you will do it anyway.

On a final note, I personally don't care for 30'06 Springfield. The .308 Winchester/7.62 NATO made it obsolete, but people keep using it. Go figure.
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Old Aug 16, 2003 | 01:46 AM
  #17  
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Originally posted by Kai


Sorry, but you've been brainwashed.

There is no such thing as a semi automatic assault rifle. One of the basic qualifying features of an assault rifle is select fire capability. Yes, it is important. The correct term in this case is "semi-automatic carbine."

Sorry, it's a common mistake (isn't it?). I haven't been brainwashed, I just live in California. Pretty much anything semi-automatic with a detachable magazine (not the box kind, I don't think) is defined as an "assault rifle" here (and is therefore illegal). I'm just applying terminology that is commonly used (and is understood by most everyone) where I live.

Move to California and no one will care what you call your AK, they'll still brand it an illegal and highly dangerous firearm that you can't have. Apparently, violent crime is prevented if law abiding citizens aren't allowed to own such firearms. All gun owners are treated like criminals here...I can't even buy a box of ammo without being fingerprinted.
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Old Aug 16, 2003 | 02:17 AM
  #18  
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Originally posted by azn_redneck
Sorry, it's a common mistake (isn't it?).
Yes, it is.

The problem is, when more people refer to them as "assault rifles," more people start to believe it. That makes it much harder to teach people that there is a difference between an AK-47 select fire assault rifle and a chinese copy MAK-90 semi-automatic carbine. The civilian MAK-90 is very different then a true military AK.

Box and drum type magazines with a capacity of over 10 rounds are banned in CA, AFAIK.

A perfect example of brainwashing by repitition is the use of the term "clip" instead of "magazine." People who are well informed on the subject will alway refer to stacked ammunition box-type feeding devices as magazines and Mannlicher type bent metal clips and stripper clips as, you guessed it, clips. Anyone who says an AK, AR, FAL, etc. feeds from a clip should not even be allowed to speak about them because they obviously have no idea what they are talking about. The easy way to remember the difference: Clips feed magazines, magazines feed rifles (or pistols, or what have you.)

But, alas, we live in a free country, where people are allowed to speak of and vote to ban stuff they know nothing about while the people who know better don't have the power to stop them.

Apparently, violent crime is prevented if law abiding citizens aren't allowed to own such firearms.
Did you know that Sen. Feinstein (D-CA) and Sen. Schumer (D-NY), the two biggest supporters of the '94 ban, both regard the NRA as an extremist organization? They think reponsible gun owners are terrorists.

As for guns killing people... I have yet to see my Intrac Mk.II (AK-74 clone), or any of my other 14 rifles, jump out of their cabinet and spontaniously shoot someone.

Man, I'm just rolling out these long posts tonight...
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Old Aug 16, 2003 | 11:25 AM
  #19  
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Originally posted by Kai
Yes, it is.

The problem is, when more people refer to them as "assault rifles," more people start to believe it. That makes it much harder to teach people that there is a difference between an AK-47 select fire assault rifle and a chinese copy MAK-90 semi-automatic carbine. The civilian MAK-90 is very different then a true military AK.

Box and drum type magazines with a capacity of over 10 rounds are banned in CA, AFAIK.

A perfect example of brainwashing by repitition is the use of the term "clip" instead of "magazine." People who are well informed on the subject will alway refer to stacked ammunition box-type feeding devices as magazines and Mannlicher type bent metal clips and stripper clips as, you guessed it, clips. Anyone who says an AK, AR, FAL, etc. feeds from a clip should not even be allowed to speak about them because they obviously have no idea what they are talking about. The easy way to remember the difference
: Clips feed magazines, magazines feed rifles (or pistols, or what have you.)

But, alas, we live in a free country, where people are allowed to speak of and vote to ban stuff they know nothing about while the people who know better don't have the power to stop them.


Did you know that Sen. Feinstein (D-CA) and Sen. Schumer (D-NY), the two biggest supporters of the '94 ban, both regard the NRA as an extremist organization? They think reponsible gun owners are terrorists.

As for guns killing people... I have yet to see my Intrac Mk.II (AK-74 clone), or any of my other 14 rifles, jump out of their cabinet and spontaniously shoot someone.

Man, I'm just rolling out these long posts tonight...
OK, so I'm assuming the select fire assult rifle means that the user can select between semi-auto, 3-round burst, and full auto. There's a guy I know who has a "semi-auto carbine," however it mysteriously has an "extra" position on the selector switch for 3-round burst.

All the mail I get from NRA-ILA talks about Feinstein and various other Democrats who are supporting anti-gun legislation and blocking judicial nominees who are members of the NRA.

Here's a fun quote out of the Assault Weapons ban:

"2275.5. The Legislature hereby finds and declares that the proliferation and use of assault weapons poses a threat to the health, safety, and security of all citizens of this state. The Legislature has restricted the assault weapons specified in Section 12276 based upon finding that each firearm has such a high rate of fire and capacity for firepower that its function as a legitimate sports or recreational firearm is substantially outweighed by the danger that it can be used to kill and injure human beings. It is the intent of the Legislature in enacting this chapter to place restrictions on the use of assault weapons and to establish a registration and permit procedure for their lawful sale and possession. It is not, however, the intent of the Legislature by this chapter to place restrictions on the use of those weapons which are primarily designed and intended for hunting, target practice, or other legitimate sports or recreational activities."

So, if responsible gun owners have assault weapons, it threatens the health, safety, and security of all citizens in California. Great.
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Old Aug 16, 2003 | 08:06 PM
  #20  
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Originally posted by azn_redneck
OK, so I'm assuming the select fire assult rifle means that the user can select between semi-auto, 3-round burst, and full auto. There's a guy I know who has a "semi-auto carbine," however it mysteriously has an "extra" position on the selector switch for 3-round burst.
Select fire means the user can choose between safe, semi-automatic, and some (or a couple) methods of automatic fire. In the case of a military AK, the choices are Safe, Semi, and Auto. On some Romanian versions, they have Safe, Semi, 3-round, and Auto. The US military is one of the few that was dim enough to eliminate full auto, and the current M16A2 (and M16A4, to my knowledge) only has Safe, Semi, and 3-round.

If your friend's rifle has the ability to do 3-round bursts and it is not NFA registered, he may have some serious legal problems in the future to the tune of $10k and 10 years in federal prison. If we are talking about an AR-15 and he has a 3-round selector switch, even though it won't fire 3-round bursts, it is still considered an automatic by Uncle Sam. Not good.

BTW, the US legal definition of "Fully Automatic" is the ability to fire more then two shots from a single chamber with one pull of the trigger. Why they chose two instead of one is beyond me, and I know of a few guys who tried to make a kit for AR-15s to fire two rounds with one pull since it is not legally considered "full auto." Well, maybe it is in California.
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