FEMA - Still not prepared for evacuations?
Originally Posted by Epoch
It's kinda crazy to see traditional state's-right'ers who are now attacking the local governments and protecting a federal organization from criticism though
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Originally Posted by Epoch
I'm just pointing out that it's FEMA's responsibility to manage (It's where the M in FEMA comes from, in fact) responses across mutliple governments and governmental agencies. It's this broader level management that would make something like opening the other lanes possible. And if you open limited sections of the opposing lanes, you can nearly double the maximum throughput of the highway. OTOH, I'm armcharing and have never witnessed an incident where this was done.
Originally Posted by Kestrel
Actually, I would submit that it doesn't change your throughput at all. Eventually, the south bound highway lanes need to switch back to the correct direction since there will be opposing traffic as you move farther north, and then guess what, you have to merge the people going north on the southbound lane back to the northbound lane, causing a jam. Ultimately, your throughput is exactly the same as having just the northbound lane. Also, if you jam up both sides, emergency services can't go into the city either.
EDIT: And once the evacuation is over, and people head back, then you are fucked. Then only one lane can be open.
Originally Posted by flyromeo3
FEMA works with local officals to evacuate the city. That I know.
Originally Posted by Kestrel
It still wouldn't matter if you opened up both directions. You still have several million people trying to exit a city through several (probably 2 or 3) main arteries, none of which are designed to carry that amount of traffic. This isn't really anybody's fault, the simple physics of the situation make it the way it is.
Originally Posted by Kestrel
Actually, I would submit that it doesn't change your throughput at all. Eventually, the south bound highway lanes need to switch back to the correct direction since there will be opposing traffic as you move farther north, and then guess what, you have to merge the people going north on the southbound lane back to the northbound lane, causing a jam. Ultimately, your throughput is exactly the same as having just the northbound lane. Also, if you jam up both sides, emergency services can't go into the city either.
Originally Posted by /^Blackbacca^\
it's simple common sense dude
So say you want to avoid that entirely and have people exit before a major metropolitan area (like Dallas). How many surface streets can handle several million cars? Probably not very many. Again, there will be major stoppages as several million cars try to exit on two or three lane exit ramps onto 3 or 4 lane roads.
Basically, all that doubling the lanes does is open up a parking lot on the other side of the highway.
Originally Posted by Kestrel
It seems intuitive that doubling the lanes doubles the throughput, but it doesn't because your bottleneck is farther north where everyone is going. Eventually, the converted southbound lane has to resume southbound service (esp as you approach cities like Dallas where people use the southbound lane) so, guess what, your northbound evacuation traffic has to merge back into the northbound lane. Which means taht there will be massive stoppage as eight lanes of highway try to merge back into 4.
So say you want to avoid that entirely and have people exit before a major metropolitan area (like Dallas). How many surface streets can handle several million cars? Probably not very many. Again, there will be major stoppages as several million cars try to exit on two or three lane exit ramps onto 3 or 4 lane roads.
Basically, all that doubling the lanes does is open up a parking lot on the other side of the highway.
So say you want to avoid that entirely and have people exit before a major metropolitan area (like Dallas). How many surface streets can handle several million cars? Probably not very many. Again, there will be major stoppages as several million cars try to exit on two or three lane exit ramps onto 3 or 4 lane roads.
Basically, all that doubling the lanes does is open up a parking lot on the other side of the highway.
Obviously. But what I'm saying is this: Maybe, somewhere, there is a guy who understands the highway dynamics much better than us, and could formulate a plan so people aren't stuck riding out a freaking Cat4 hurricane in their cars. So, at this point, unless an act of god occurs to stop this storm altogether, things are going to go from bad to worse for these people. I'm just saying it's something we should ponder, because of little other possible alternatives.
And to the people protecting FEMA: Goddamnit it's FEMA's job to direct the local gov'ts. They're the central player in managing the event both before and after the disaster (If you don't believe me, read their charter), and while we have yet to really see how the local governments are preparing for the event and it's aftermath, this hurricane will really be the litmus test for this organization's ability.
Originally Posted by Epoch
Obviously. But what I'm saying is this: Maybe, somewhere, there is a guy who understands the highway dynamics much better than us, and could formulate a plan so people aren't stuck riding out a freaking Cat4 hurricane in their cars. So, at this point, unless an act of god occurs to stop this storm altogether, things are going to go from bad to worse for these people. I'm just saying it's something we should ponder, because of little other possible alternatives.
And to the people protecting FEMA: Goddamnit it's FEMA's job to direct the local gov'ts. They're the central player in managing the event both before and after the disaster (If you don't believe me, read their charter), and while we have yet to really see how the local governments are preparing for the event and it's aftermath, this hurricane will really be the litmus test for this organization's ability.
And to the people protecting FEMA: Goddamnit it's FEMA's job to direct the local gov'ts. They're the central player in managing the event both before and after the disaster (If you don't believe me, read their charter), and while we have yet to really see how the local governments are preparing for the event and it's aftermath, this hurricane will really be the litmus test for this organization's ability.
Originally Posted by Kestrel
And what I'm saying is that the way American cities are structured pretty much prevents a mass exodus. No matter what FEMA or anybody does, evacuating millions of people from a city is always going to look the way it does now. We are too dependent on personal transportation in the United States; an evacuation depends on individuals moving themselves out since there is not enough public transportation infrastructure to move people out more efficiently.
Oh, I know that. Hell, if a natural disaster like that was headed towords my town, I'd be proper boned. But that's why I keep 20 gallons of pure water onhand, know how to tap into my waterheater for add. water, have a water purifier, keep a 1 month supply of non-perishable foods and MREs, have extra batteries, several first aid kits, and stuffs like that. The only thing I don't have (and is highlighted by the whole NO ordeal) is a gun, but that's cause my girlfriend would flip
h:And before people go OMGWTFLOLBBQ teh librocrat wants a gun! Hypocrite!!!1!1!, I'm not against gun ownership, just gun control, and I'm more than happy to follow even CA's gun ownership laws. I'd just get something like a Glock 22 or 35...


