Just an FYI so you know more about the ANWR issue... it will take 15 years before we can get ANY oil out of the area, and we would save more oil as a nation by changing the aerodynamics of our tires for the next 15 years than what we could ever drill out of there. The only reason why Bush wants to open that land up is that so he can set a precedent to open almost any protected wildland in the US. Smoke and mirrors my friend, and this administration is full of them environmentally. The ANWR is just a pawn for them to get a checkmate.

We have the means to, within the next 5 years, cut our dependance on foreign oil by half, and we can do it economically. The problem is that the oil and domestic automotive lobbies hold such strength with the current administration that there will be no positive change environmentally as long as Bush is in office.

 

the thing is, they're not random.. they're common and they're just examples. too bad you can't extract your head from your ass enough to see anything.

 

USSR = Union of Soviet SOCIALIST Republics:doh: an extreme case of socialism, but socialism none the less

 

Do you even know the structural and ideological differences between Communism, Capitalism, and Socialism?


You used that same argument on me a long time ago, and it's frankly, completely nonsensical. USSR was a communist government, and countries like Sweden, Denmark, and Canada are socialist. Quite different, huh?

By the same token, we call ourselves a Democracy, when we're actually a Republic with some concepts of Democracy fused in...

 

Just an FYI for you to better understand the drilling in ANWAR we could setup, drill and have useable oil in as little as 2 years. Which means had Bush' energy policy been passed when it was proposed we would not be paying $2 a gallon for gas.

 

Socialism is where they tax the living hell out of you but then in return provide for you basic necessities such as healthcare, public transportation, welfare, etc. I personally do not trust the government to run these things for me and would prefer that I control my own destiny and be able to make my own choices about healthplans, etc.

Which is why I have no problems admitting to Mike's statement above.

 

actually, if you want to get into definitions and the idology of communism, there has never been a truly communist government. the USSR was a novel effort but ended up being no more than an extreme form of socialism. it's called Marxian-socialism for a reason. communism was the intended end product, but it never got that far. Sweden, Denmark, canada, etc.. are not extreme forms of socialism, but the same problems are still inherent on a smaller scale as Sweden is figuring out.link as well as Canada with their constant health care issues

and if you want to get technical about it.. you're right, we're not a democracy. we're an aristocracy. a republic is a state or organization who has a chief of state that is not a monarch; democracy, aristocracy, etc... are different practices of government of such states.. apples and oranges

 

2 years to build the pipeline, all of the infrastructure to build and maintain the facilities, the facilities themselves, to find the best resources of oil, and to train and/or relocate staff? You overestimate the feasibility of the situation. I'd say 5-7 years to do that, if they include a modest amount of thought ahead planning, and at least 10 years to do it right, if rushed.

But that doesn't stop the validity of my point that, if we want to eliminate our dependance on foreign oil, why not build more efficient cars and more efficient houses/businesses? Because the industry doesn't want you to stop consuming at the rate you are. This Bush administration has the best interest of the Big Business, not the People, in mind.

And the reason it's only $2 a gallon (We pay 2.40~2.70 here) is because of massive federal subsidies that your tax dollars pay for. Why don't we cut funding to the oil companies and let us get more choice over our spending instead of cutting education? Because the Bush administration knows where it's priorities lie if it wants to get reelected.

 

You realize that Kerry wants to add a 50cent/gallon tax on gas if he gets elected don't you :dunno:

 

Now now, be fair. That's not entirely true.

What is true is that Kerry has, on multiple occasions, voted for a $0.50 per gallon gas tax in the past. Whether or not he supports that now is a different story, and you know with Kerry - it very well could have changed.

In any case, it's not entirely fair to say that he *will add* that tax if he gets elected... at this point anyway. Maybe he'll say something that will point us in that direction, but as of now I think that's a broad assumption.

That said, is there really anyway to know what Kerry is going to do in office? The guy changes his mind so often and is lacking core beliefs in such a way that it scares me to think that he'd have the worlds most powerful military and nuclear arsenal at his fingertips.