clowN

whats better? short ram intake? or cold air intake?

are they pretty much the same performance wise?

also, i hear u cant drive in the rain with cold air intake?

what about short ram?

can anyone clear this up for me?

monkey

heavy rain + CAI = hydrolock.

short rams don't have this issue (unless you're driving in 3 feet of water, which means you've got other problems)

the CAI pulls air from behind the fender, the filter is at the same height as your brake rotor. the waterproofing in this part of the car is not as tight as it is in the engine bay, where a Short Ram would mount.

the CAI bypass valves are supposedly worthless b/c they defeat any gains made on the CAI.

the Short ram won't help as much because the air you're pulling is hotter.

prelude1897

Short Ram=Low end power
CAI=High end power

clickwir

Short ram will give better throttle responce. Not much but a fraction of a second faster than the CAI from when you push down on the pedal to the engine reacting. CAI is still faster than stock but shortram is faster than that. Shortram will also not have the benefit of pulling in cold air, but hot air.

CAI... I prefer this. Hydrolock, yes more of a potential problem than short ram, HOWEVER.... the chance of a hydrolock is very slim. Unless you are regularly traveling through a foot of water for more than 30 feet... then there's not much chance anything will happen.

Yea you might get a slightly higher moisture amount in your engine on a heavy rain day if the filter gets damp... but it won't cause any problems. If it's raining that heavy, you should slow down, which is less pull on the intake therefore almost elminating the chance of anything happening.

Yea the bypass valve will help if you like to submerge your car in water... but other than that it's going to defeat any gains from a CAI and make it pretty much pointless.

I would go with the AEM CAI, tested and proven. I have the AEM CAI and have driven just fine in many heavy rain storms. One of our heaviest amounts of rain on record this summer and I've had no problems with it. I've gone through big puddles and splashes and regularly drive 30+ mins in a heavy downpour on the highway at 75mph... I mean uh 55mph, yea and have had no problems. :goodjob:

clowN

so, cold air, no by pass valve?


by pass valve would lower the air going into the motor alot?

or insanely alittle to where it shouldnt matter?

fizzbob7

the bypass valve will usually cost you one horsepower.....nothing you'll ever notice....CAI will make more top end power and on hot days, stand apart from a short ram even more...it's quieter too.....short ram is cheaper and easier to install, but won't make as much power on the top end or midrange, but maybe as much or a touch more on the bottom end.....but when doing dyno runs, the hood is usually open, giving the short ram an advantage it wouldn't normally have...cooler air....they suck in the 150 degree engine air, which isn't good, but it's less restrictive than stock and makes more power in that aspect.....basically, a well designed CAI is the best as far as performance goes on MOST cars.....hydrolocking shouldn't happen unless you do something really stupid, like try to drive through way too much water......at stock ride height, it should be over 14" off the ground, protected from everything, so when it's wet outside, you won't be slinging water all over it or anything....it's in a completely closed off place in the bumper/fender.........

monkey

i've seen enough threads (1 or 2) about guys hydrolocking in heavy rain. who knows what their wheel wells were like, or what they did to their cars, but it's enough of a risk and not enough of a reward to warrant getting a CAI. Type S airbox or Short Ram + Cold Air box might be safer for those living in wet places.

Bypass valves costing you 1 HP leaves a net gain of around 1.2 HP to the wheels. :P we talking 1hp at the crank or the wheels?

and about dyno testing with open or closed hoods and the short ram: the ambient air temperature inside of the engine compartment at speed has been shown to be pretty much the same as the temperature outside. The airflow into the engine bay and the movement of air insures that the short ram pulls cold-ish air (depending on the weather). The only problem is when accelerating from a stop, when the air in the engine bay has been stagnant for a few and has heated up. I haven't done my own tests because i'm not sure i care that much, but a friend of mine who worked at DC said that told me this.

i have an AEM CAI. i like it. Don't think i'd want anything else at this point.

fizzbob7

ok.....heat rises...that's why vents are put in the hood.....i've done my own tests with this sort of thing on turbocharged cars....one was a stock 94 rx7, a 95 mustang gt, and an 85 xr4ti......on the rx7, the intake is on the same side as the turbos.....with an infrared gun, the plastic box part of the stock intake would hit around 225 degrees under normal driving during 85degree or similar weather.....a short ram would be drawing the air in at that temp......with the hood up on a dyno, still 100% stock, the box only registered 170 degrees........that's 55 degrees difference, which is what the short ram would experience therefore giving it a 5% higher reading on the dyno numbers....so you're getting a dyno that says the car is making 5% more hp than it really is while you're driving....a big deal.....on the mustang with a few mods, it was only about a 30 degree difference, but still, 3% of it's power....3% of 225hp is almost 7whp.....a very real difference.....on the xr4ti, it was the worst though....it's known for a super hot engine compartment.....the intake box hit around 250 degrees....cutting the sides off to allow it to draw in air from the engine comparment wouldn't make a difference with the hood up....we ran it with the hood down and the fans blowing on the front like it would be going down the road and with the box open, it would experience detonation and lost 15hp from 2500rpm to 6200rpm........some of the loss was due to the knock sensor killing the timing, but that's because air coming in was too hot.....most of the time, the restriction on n/a cars is worse than the heat you'll be getting, so either makes power...on turbo cars, it's usually not.......10 degrees = 1% of your total hp

and the bypass valve kills 1hp to the wheels from what i've seen...sometimes not 1 full hp.......

clickwir

Complete hydrolock from just heavy rain? You'd have to take in at least 2-4 cups of water for that to happen. Hydrolock causes damage too, like things bent or broken.

Hydrolock is very diffrent from just getting some water and your engine stalling and not starting for a day or 2.

Well it doesn't really matter, the only people that have a chance of hydrolocking right now are in VA, MD and NC.

monkey

there was a thread on H-T recently regarding this. i suppose i could search.

hold on.

http://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=591622

"Funny thing was that it didn't flood the entire filter. I got into a heated debate on another board about bypass filters, and how you can only hydrolock if you submerge the entire filter, but I just got some heavy spray on mine, and it just sucked a LOT of water and siezed. All cylinders were full up into the runners with water, and I had to drain it all out...I didn't really get why #1 snapped.
Even though it sucks now, something good's gonna come out of it"

yeah it'd better be heavy rain, and maybe your bumper, wheel well fender is full of holes but it's enough to make me leery.

also, with all the potential to hit a standing puddle on the freeway or whatever, u'd better be careful, or ready to install the stock airbox come rainy season.