I had a conversation with a higher-up engineer at American Honda...
11-13-2002, 06:49 PM
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I had a conversation with a chief product engineer at American Honda...
I work for my university part-time callin up alumni and bugging them for donations. Tonight I happened to call up this dude who is a Chief Product Engineer at American Honda. He even donated too! I thought that this would be a great opportunity to see if I could squeeze any morsels of information out of him. Most of the stuff he told me we already know but some stuff is a bit interesting.
Turns out he's the head engineer for the TL and JDM Honda Sabre and Inspire. Interesting little tidbit here, it was actually designed here in America specifically for the American market and to create the Inspire/Sabre they just made it RHD and slapped on some 'H' badges. The TL isn't getting a stick. Just not gonna happen. The TSX is going to be the "sporty" model so there's no need to make the TL with a stick. Expect a new model with a fall 2003 introduction as a 2004 model year.
I bugged him about the Si. He flat out said that they're just not selling. Basically they're gonna lower the price and see if it sells, otherwise 2003 could very well be the last model year for it. I told him they would sell tons of em if they could just stick some 16" wheels on it and make it sit a little lower. He brought up a possibility that sounds a bit interesting. They are seriously considering making an Si coupe like the '99-'00 if the hatchback flops. The reasoning behind the decision is that the styling of the hatch is just too weird for the American market but they're not ready to give up on the Si concept just yet. So for 2004 we might see a Civic coupe with the Si drivetrain transplanted over to it, plus some additional enhancements.
Next up was the TSX. I commented that the 2-liter from the RSX-S seemed a bit small for an Accord-sized car. He seemed pretty confident that there would be sufficient performance on hand. When questioned about a hypothetical 3 rocker i-VTEC 2.4-liter he said that the stroke is too long to make a revver out of it. So I'm led to two possible conclusions. One is that the TSX will have the exact same drivetrain options as the RSX. The other is the base model will have the RSX-S motor and the TSX-S will have the DC5-R motor. You know which I'd prefer.
He also seemed pretty pessimistic about any sort of Type-R car coming to this country. Basically they brought the ITR over here because of the inordinately long product cycle of the Integra and since they are now changing the models up every 4 to 5 years tops he doesn't see a high likelyhood of Honda Japan agreeing to sell the really hot stuff in this country.
On to the Element. This was led into by talking about the 2.4-liter. Apparently they have been out driving around in the hands of manager-types for the last week and have been gaining great responses from the public. I don't have the sales numbers but I'm pretty sure the RAV4 is clobbering the CR-V at the moment, so the Element should at the very least have a halo effect of bringing more people into the Honda stores. People looking at the Element stand a good chance of ending up in a CR-V since it's more practical.
And of course, you know I couldn't have a conversation with the head engineer of the TL without asking him about the transmission fiasco. He kind of skirted around the question and brought up the deal that Honda has with GM to start selling them drivetrains. Apparently Honda is trying to move away from six-cylinder motors so they can get more cars ULEV certified and also advertise higher EPA fuel economy figures. So Honda is selling six cylinder drivetrains to GM to be used in a future Saturn model. Probably the next L-series although it should be called something different. He was not thrilled with the decision to sell anything to GM.
I did forget to ask about the RL and anything about a V8 but my guess is he wasn't going to tell me about anything that is that much of a departure for the company.
Cliff's Notes:
-No stick shift for TL. Redesign in fall 2003.
-2003 might be the last model year for the Si hatch. Possible Si coupe for 2004.
-TSX most likely will have a couple 2.0-liter motors in various levels of tune.
-Possibility of Type-R models being sold in this country is very low.
-Elements have been drivin around for about a week, initial reaction seems to be awesome.
-Honda is specifically selling V6 powertrains to GM for a future Saturn model.
-I forgot to ask about the RL and the V8.
Turns out he's the head engineer for the TL and JDM Honda Sabre and Inspire. Interesting little tidbit here, it was actually designed here in America specifically for the American market and to create the Inspire/Sabre they just made it RHD and slapped on some 'H' badges. The TL isn't getting a stick. Just not gonna happen. The TSX is going to be the "sporty" model so there's no need to make the TL with a stick. Expect a new model with a fall 2003 introduction as a 2004 model year.
I bugged him about the Si. He flat out said that they're just not selling. Basically they're gonna lower the price and see if it sells, otherwise 2003 could very well be the last model year for it. I told him they would sell tons of em if they could just stick some 16" wheels on it and make it sit a little lower. He brought up a possibility that sounds a bit interesting. They are seriously considering making an Si coupe like the '99-'00 if the hatchback flops. The reasoning behind the decision is that the styling of the hatch is just too weird for the American market but they're not ready to give up on the Si concept just yet. So for 2004 we might see a Civic coupe with the Si drivetrain transplanted over to it, plus some additional enhancements.
Next up was the TSX. I commented that the 2-liter from the RSX-S seemed a bit small for an Accord-sized car. He seemed pretty confident that there would be sufficient performance on hand. When questioned about a hypothetical 3 rocker i-VTEC 2.4-liter he said that the stroke is too long to make a revver out of it. So I'm led to two possible conclusions. One is that the TSX will have the exact same drivetrain options as the RSX. The other is the base model will have the RSX-S motor and the TSX-S will have the DC5-R motor. You know which I'd prefer.
He also seemed pretty pessimistic about any sort of Type-R car coming to this country. Basically they brought the ITR over here because of the inordinately long product cycle of the Integra and since they are now changing the models up every 4 to 5 years tops he doesn't see a high likelyhood of Honda Japan agreeing to sell the really hot stuff in this country.
On to the Element. This was led into by talking about the 2.4-liter. Apparently they have been out driving around in the hands of manager-types for the last week and have been gaining great responses from the public. I don't have the sales numbers but I'm pretty sure the RAV4 is clobbering the CR-V at the moment, so the Element should at the very least have a halo effect of bringing more people into the Honda stores. People looking at the Element stand a good chance of ending up in a CR-V since it's more practical.
And of course, you know I couldn't have a conversation with the head engineer of the TL without asking him about the transmission fiasco. He kind of skirted around the question and brought up the deal that Honda has with GM to start selling them drivetrains. Apparently Honda is trying to move away from six-cylinder motors so they can get more cars ULEV certified and also advertise higher EPA fuel economy figures. So Honda is selling six cylinder drivetrains to GM to be used in a future Saturn model. Probably the next L-series although it should be called something different. He was not thrilled with the decision to sell anything to GM.
I did forget to ask about the RL and anything about a V8 but my guess is he wasn't going to tell me about anything that is that much of a departure for the company.
Cliff's Notes:
-No stick shift for TL. Redesign in fall 2003.
-2003 might be the last model year for the Si hatch. Possible Si coupe for 2004.
-TSX most likely will have a couple 2.0-liter motors in various levels of tune.
-Possibility of Type-R models being sold in this country is very low.
-Elements have been drivin around for about a week, initial reaction seems to be awesome.
-Honda is specifically selling V6 powertrains to GM for a future Saturn model.
-I forgot to ask about the RL and the V8.
11-14-2002, 07:43 AM
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In my ultimate curiousity I just checked out Honda UK's site for info on the new Accord. Powertrain options are the K20A3 (a.k.a. base-model RSX and Si hatch motor) with a 5-speed and a 2.4-liter 190 ps somethin-or-other with a 6-speed.
11-14-2002, 10:00 AM
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That's awesome!!! I was one of the one's waiting for the Si coupe to come back
Tried really hard to like the hatch, but it never grew on me. On the other hand you shouldn't have to try to like a car. Either you liek it or you don't...:thumbup:
Tried really hard to like the hatch, but it never grew on me. On the other hand you shouldn't have to try to like a car. Either you liek it or you don't...:thumbup:
11-14-2002, 10:01 AM
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Booty the only thing I am lost on is the whole transmission thing. Was he basically saying that Honda is going to try and dump the V6 in favor of 4 bangers, and if so where does that leave the TL RL MDX Pilot NSX etc...??? I am not sure this is a good idea. Great post though...and make sure you keep his number...it is always nice ti have an inside connection.
11-14-2002, 12:39 PM
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Good stuff bro. All review except for the Si Coupe,which is very interesting.
I'm still confused on the TSX...I knew that it wasn't an ideal revver, but I figgered that they'd be able to squeeze 220HP out of it and make it a very torque engine. But I guess not. I just can't imagine the K20A5 in an Accord type car
But the coolest part is talking to the engineer. Did he give you anything to bite on as far as the next TL?
I'm still confused on the TSX...I knew that it wasn't an ideal revver, but I figgered that they'd be able to squeeze 220HP out of it and make it a very torque engine. But I guess not. I just can't imagine the K20A5 in an Accord type car
But the coolest part is talking to the engineer. Did he give you anything to bite on as far as the next TL?