02RSXTYPES said that Toyota cant make performance engines. What about the 1UZ-FE or 1JZ-GTE? The first is from the GS430 4.3L DOCH V8 which gets better gas milage than a RL's 3.0V6 and it puts out way more power. The second motor is a 3.0I6 from the Supra TwinTurbo (13.6 e/t stock).. which would, needless to say, blow your RSX to bloody hell (or any other Honda product for that matter) Not to mention that engine, and all Toyota engines, but this one especially is virtually bulletproof and is able to take crazy amounts of horsepower on stock internals. I should know, i have been building Toyota/Honda engines for a long time. So know what you're talkin about first. Oh yeah, Toyota pioneered Variable Valve Timing. :thumbup:

 

He was right. Just because they 1JZ-GTE is a good engine, doesnt mean that Toyota is a performance engine company. They need help from friggin yamaha to get some power out of the celica engine. Look at every toyota/lexus model, they always come in last place in the hp ratings for their catagorey.
Also, the RL's V6 (3.5L not 3.0L) is a joke, you should have compared it to the NSX's 3.2L V6 that makes the same power as the 4.3L V8 of Toyota's.
So the Supra will blow his RSX to bloddy hell, hmmm, a rwd twin turbo inline-6 that cost what, 15,000 more than an RSX-S new should be able to do that. Chevy rules cuz the Z06 can beat a Supra!

 

Redline, first of all you only named 2 toyota engines that have performance. Guess what, last I checked the Supra hasn't been bought in US for 4 years.
For $50,000 + I hope the GS can out perform the 6 year old RL.

Don't get me wrong, the Supra TT is my favorite Japanese car, after the NSX and Skyline.
And for $50k I'd definitely buy a GS over a 5 series and probably over the E class.

However, Toyota is not a performance company.

If they were the Camry would not be the worst performing midsized sedan on the market, the Avalon would at least run with a base TL (225hp) in performance, 4Runner would have had an increase in hp sometime in the past decade, while it has been sporting a tiny 180hp V6 that only performs good off road and not on the highway.

 

"02RSXTYPES said that Toyota cant make performance engines." I don't think that's true at all. They might not have the experiences with the VVTL-i stuff, that's why they co-design with Yamaha, but that doesn't mean Toyota can't make performance engines. Key word, "CAN'T". As pointed out above, you can't get much more bullet proof than the Supra engine. How about the old MR-2 engine, 2.0L Turbo that can handle massive boost on stock internal. That's proof enough for me that if they wan't to, they can do it.

 

You guys are bringing up great engines, but Toyota hasn't had them in this country for years.
Toyota can build performance engines but are to lazy and boring to do so anymore.
In performance they have always taken a backseat to Nissan and Honda, so they stopped trying.

 

honda is the n/a king...especially in 4 bangers...its prowess in motorcycle racing & motorsports helps it produce some astounding engines...those that are jealous (yes jealous) always say a honda engine has no torque...they are well misinformed b/c high end torque is the key to racing engines b/c it takes advantage of gearing

toyota is a company that was not founded upon racing such as honda, ferrari, porsche, bmw, etc...it's bread and butter is overall good quality cars that do everything well but nothing exceptionally well...that's why they sell b/c of its products are well rounded

toyota started racing b/c it wants to market it as such...its motivation is more PR advertising than the religious task that ferrari or honda would take...i'm not a big fan of toyota b/c of it...it usually solves problems by throwing money at them instead of getting down in the nitty gritty

toyota does make some performance engines...the supra/celica/mr2 are all great examples...toyota just contracted out for help (usually from yamaha)...the gt-s celica is one of the few current offerings that toyota has that is a sportscar...the mrs is also a great addition but does not have a willing engine...it may in the future

 

Toyota is now the General Motors of Japan......The whole fat cat syndrome. Also redline, you can't compare an RSX to a TT Supra. How about a new NSX????? They are alot closer together than you'd think. Honda does, hands down make the best engines in the world........Besides, that old six from Toyota has had head gasket problems for years and they never fixed the problem........

 

Its funny how the purpose of a forum is to argue. Anyway, I meant 3.5 L for the RL. Simple typo, i know my engines =p Why is the RL, Acura's flagship luxury sedan, severely underpowered compared to it's rivals (GS-series, LS430, BMW 5/7) Don't get me wrong I love Honda too but I think different companies build their cars for different reasons. I know Toyota isn't a performance company, but they are more than capable of building kick-ass driving machines. Look at the LS430, it outperforms the Infinity Q45 in the quartermile and 0-60 EVEN though the Q has 60 or so more horses under the hood AND weighs less than the LS. And I wouldnt say Toyota Camry performs poor, it just isnt as quick in the quarter mile as some of its competitors, Trust me that 1MZ-FE is a tried and true engine, regarded by many as the best darn six cylinder in the world. Its smooth as silk. Camrys just arent made for the quarter mile, theyre made for families. Meaning dont call it a bad car just cause it cant race some of its competitors-- and win.

 

Oh and another typo for "Infinity" I meant Infiniti.

 

The Q45's HP ratings are probabily slightly falsified and I think Nissan has some power-sucking transmissions.

I don't know how this topic got started but I will agree with both sides. My dad used to have a GS400 and it was a very nice car. It had a powerful yet smooth as butta' engine. I think Toyota is capable of building a performance engine. If Honda and Toyota were in a 'Build a Performance Engine' contest I think we would see two totally different engines, Honda's being a naturally aspirated four-cylinder and Toyota's being a four or six-cylinder with some kind of artificial aspirated. Both would have their strengths, both their weaknesses.

At this time though, Toyota chooses not to offer a 'performance' engine in the US market. I personally think the MR2 Spyder or whatever it is officially called should have the 180hp as the Celica GT-S and Matrix XRS/Vibe GT.