Key word is Trying... No mention of succeeding or failing...

I'm a bit disappointed in the reactions from the mods and admins but whatever... EDITED:XXXXXXX

I'd like to point out a couple of things... the original post.

Has anyone who is giving me attitude actually done any chip tuning?

and is there any mention anywhere in the original post about generic ebay type chips? Or was that an assumption on other members parts? There are quite a few other methods of tuning Roms other than the band aid Vafc/Safc and the overpriced Hondata... and the fact that those are the only methods mentioned shows that some people need to do a little more research on what's available out there...

 

All I said was you were wrong. I didn't attack you. And I still say you were 1/2 wrong. There was no name calling and I am not implying you don't know what you are doing all the time or are unintelligent in anyway. please don't put words in my mouth.



I've done plenty of Tuning. How would you like me to prove this to you? I suspect we would agree on a lot of things. No need for a chip on your shoulder we can all discuss this and not completely agree.

Hondata might not be cheap but it does WAY more than any chip alone will do. I don't understand why you have it out for them? Does a plain chipped ECU datalog? Can you control nitrous? Will it allow you to tune for boost on a 3Bar Map sesnor? Can it control VTEC based on vacuum as well as throttle position and oil pressure?

I'm not saying chipping alone can't do some of those things but I am saying that chipping alone won't do everything and won't do some of it as well.

By the time you buy a ROM emulator at $180 and a Chip Burner at $180 you are in $360. You can buy a Hondata S200 for $295 retail. You can buy the features you need if any and you are still going to have to pay a tuner regardless of system if you don't have the software, emulator, burner and know how. It isn't fair to expect all of these people will have the knowledge to tune their cars alone so that is a price consideration to take into account.

The Hondata does cost more than plain old chip burning but plain old chip burning isn't practical for the average Joe and sometimes isn't as effective. Try and help them with info without shoving your preferences down their throat. I have a stand alone on my car and I don't have a Hondata on my car (but I do own one) but I have used one and tuned several and they work great. I am sure your methods work great too but that doesn't mean using a VAFC is wrong it just means their are lots of options.

 

I fail to see any difference between what you said to me and what I said to Sleeper... even one of your own mods disagreed with his statement... I merely didn't appreciate being chastised like a child by you when all I did was state my reasons for disagreeing with Sleeper...It might have only been a perceived notion on my part...but I honestly don't think I was immature about it in any way with the possible exception of my very first comment... but I did not post any response after Hyde posted the knock it off comment...

No need for a **** measuring contest...no need to prove yourself to me (or anyone else for that matter) esp. over the internet... I think you would agree..and I'm not sure if the pun was intended or not but it made me laugh...

I hate to say it... but you are only 1/2 right on that point... but I my myself am only 1/2 right as well... It's just a matter of semantics but yes a chip alone will not do what a bells and whistles Hondata system will... but that is also a grey area... because a basic S200 does not do much more than a simple chip either... Just throwing an external ROM in an ECU will not equal a fully trimmed Hond4t4 system... but there are several add ons and tools that can be utilized to compare to the options hond4t4 boasts... and they cannot be beat cost-wise...

I don't really have all that much against Hondata...it's a decent system, just overpriced and over mystified... it is essentially just a chipped ECU with certain options like DL, Boost control, etc...and Doug feels he has a monoply on this technology...

There is amazing freeware out there that can rival and in some cases surpass a Hondata system... with the possible exception of the Stage 4 dealer setup...but yes a chipped ECU can be configured to datalog, control N20, tune for 3bar boost, read a TPS only system among other things like FTL and FTS... I am a bit sketchy on the VTEC details as it's not my specialty and I have had no reason to look into it...

That staement is true... but then again as you add these options to a Hondata system, the price increases quite a bit.. $200 a pop on certain things if I remember right...

You are getting ripped off if you are paying those prices for those components...unless you have other uses for them... on a basic setup you can come in at well under the $295 Hond4t4 system... and the features or options for Hondata will run you $200 for each upgrade like datalogging, tuning software...etc That is my main complaint with Hond4t4...yes it is a tunable system but the options are waaay overpriced...

But I will agree that some just don't have the time, patience or drive to learn how to tune their cars...and would rather pay someone else to do it....

But that's what I like about the budget users... by the time you have a sense of what you are doing as far as the specifics of using the software as well as the hardware, you have learned many of the basic principles already...and the details are there also as you need them....it is a steep learning curve but not impossible...and the people are are the most unselfish bunch I have run into... a very community oriented spirit... sometimes a bit on the harsh side as far making you learn on your own but it really is required... if you are spoon fed all the info you will not understand certain aspects... and in the end it is better that way... great selfless community though...

But alas you are probably right... the average Joe isn't really willing to take the time to learn...and without the right tuning tools can be less effective...and I might have been a bit preferential in my suggestions... but it is only because you can acheive what an $800-1000 Hondata system can do (not including tuning) for less than $200...and still come in well under half the price including the right tools to tune it yourself...

but there is no right way to go I suppose... do what you're comfortable with is my motto...Too many options is never a bad thing...

 

Also, I would like to say that it is nice to have a discussion of this nature that def started out on the wrong foot not degrede into an arguement...

I was quite surprised by your rational response to my post... Honestly I expected it to go a bit differently... So I shall edit out certain comments I made about HAN, it's staff and the general attitude that were immature on my part and unsubstantiated assumptions... Def my bad... I will make no excuses because I know I can be a bit brash and sometimes even borderline hostile when pointing out what I feel are inaccuracies or wrong information...

But I'd also like to publicly say that I misjudged your intent in your first post... Nothing wrong with keeping the peace... and looking out for your members... Good job...and I would expect nothing less from a good admin...

 

You can always expect good discussion from me about tuning. It is really where my car hobby has taken me. Anyone can bolt on a header but understanding tuning is almost artful.

No need to argue although we might disagree. Glad we cleared the air.

Everyone . . . carry on!

 

Geeze, Asahi, remind me not to get on your bad side.

 

sweet i am learning