point well taken.......its just that dont you guys think that if this was a very reliable setup, that honda would have already been mass producing it in some high performance integra or something ? I'm not saying that the setup is not fast.....you can look at 1/4 mile times for ls/vtecs and you can see that they kick ass.... I'm just saying that if the setup was all its cracked up to be...honda would have had the foresight to see this, and they would have taken advantage of it.