Alignment steering problem
03-04-2004, 06:31 PM
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Alignment steering problem
I have a 1995 Civic DX, and I had alignment done a while ago, sometime around August. Everything was perfect, until one night, back around October I hit a huge pothole, and immediately after my steering wheel became off-center. I had to hold it like 5 degrees to the left in order to go straight, although the car didnt pull to any direction, otherwords, if I moved the wheel 5 degrees to the left and let go of it, the car would go in a perfectly straight line, without pulling to any side, given of course that the pavement is smooth.
So I went back to the alignment shop and told them what happened. The guy put my car onto the alignment machine, and to my surprise the wheel alignment was perfect, just the steering wheel was off-center. Due to this fact, the guy didnt even mess with the wheel alignment, he just put the steering wheel on center, and then messed with something in the suspension until his computer said that the steering wheel was centered. The whole operation took a lot less time than a whole alignment as well.
So I hopped back into my car, and went for a ride. To my disappointment I found that after this alignment I had to hold the steering wheel about 5 degrees to the RIGHT for the car to go straight. As before, the car didnt pull to any side, and would go perfectly straight if i let go of the steering wheel while its turned about 5 degrees to the right.
I didn't go back to the alignment shop to complain, because I figured that something in the suspension must be bent and causing this abnormality. I saw the computer reading, which showed that alignment was perfect, and I saw that the steering wheel was perfectly centered during adjustment, so I figured that it must be a mechanical problem, and not alignment.
Since then (october 2003) I drove good 6,000-7,000 miles, with this steering issue. I regularly check tire wear, and the tires are wear is perfectly even, so I'm quite sure the alignment is fine.
However, the car now is showing its age, and I am about to take it to a fairly major repair. Both axles are knocking, passenged side wheel hub is making funny noise, power steering fluid is leaking. So I figure if I am gonna spend a bunch of money on this repair, which is gonna require alignment after it anyway, I might as well try and see what is causing the steering wheel to be off-center and fix it, if its a critical problem, or just inexpensive to fix.
What should I look into? I know basic things about civic suspension, I dont know jack about rack and pinion system, the steering columnt, etc. What do you guys think is causing this problem?
Also, on a side not, whats up with civic's axles? I replaced them on my civic about 4 years ago, when it had about 75,000 on it, and now it had 118,000 and they are shot again. Shouldn't they last a little longer?
So I went back to the alignment shop and told them what happened. The guy put my car onto the alignment machine, and to my surprise the wheel alignment was perfect, just the steering wheel was off-center. Due to this fact, the guy didnt even mess with the wheel alignment, he just put the steering wheel on center, and then messed with something in the suspension until his computer said that the steering wheel was centered. The whole operation took a lot less time than a whole alignment as well.
So I hopped back into my car, and went for a ride. To my disappointment I found that after this alignment I had to hold the steering wheel about 5 degrees to the RIGHT for the car to go straight. As before, the car didnt pull to any side, and would go perfectly straight if i let go of the steering wheel while its turned about 5 degrees to the right.
I didn't go back to the alignment shop to complain, because I figured that something in the suspension must be bent and causing this abnormality. I saw the computer reading, which showed that alignment was perfect, and I saw that the steering wheel was perfectly centered during adjustment, so I figured that it must be a mechanical problem, and not alignment.
Since then (october 2003) I drove good 6,000-7,000 miles, with this steering issue. I regularly check tire wear, and the tires are wear is perfectly even, so I'm quite sure the alignment is fine.
However, the car now is showing its age, and I am about to take it to a fairly major repair. Both axles are knocking, passenged side wheel hub is making funny noise, power steering fluid is leaking. So I figure if I am gonna spend a bunch of money on this repair, which is gonna require alignment after it anyway, I might as well try and see what is causing the steering wheel to be off-center and fix it, if its a critical problem, or just inexpensive to fix.
What should I look into? I know basic things about civic suspension, I dont know jack about rack and pinion system, the steering columnt, etc. What do you guys think is causing this problem?
Also, on a side not, whats up with civic's axles? I replaced them on my civic about 4 years ago, when it had about 75,000 on it, and now it had 118,000 and they are shot again. Shouldn't they last a little longer?
03-04-2004, 06:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Ochdx
I have a 1995 Civic DX, and I had alignment done a while ago, sometime around August. Everything was perfect, until one night, back around October I hit a huge pothole, and immediately after my steering wheel became off-center. I had to hold it like 5 degrees to the left in order to go straight, although the car didnt pull to any direction, otherwords, if I moved the wheel 5 degrees to the left and let go of it, the car would go in a perfectly straight line, without pulling to any side, given of course that the pavement is smooth.
So I went back to the alignment shop and told them what happened. The guy put my car onto the alignment machine, and to my surprise the wheel alignment was perfect, just the steering wheel was off-center. Due to this fact, the guy didnt even mess with the wheel alignment, he just put the steering wheel on center, and then messed with something in the suspension until his computer said that the steering wheel was centered. The whole operation took a lot less time than a whole alignment as well.
So I hopped back into my car, and went for a ride. To my disappointment I found that after this alignment I had to hold the steering wheel about 5 degrees to the RIGHT for the car to go straight. As before, the car didnt pull to any side, and would go perfectly straight if i let go of the steering wheel while its turned about 5 degrees to the right.
I didn't go back to the alignment shop to complain, because I figured that something in the suspension must be bent and causing this abnormality. I saw the computer reading, which showed that alignment was perfect, and I saw that the steering wheel was perfectly centered during adjustment, so I figured that it must be a mechanical problem, and not alignment.
Since then (october 2003) I drove good 6,000-7,000 miles, with this steering issue. I regularly check tire wear, and the tires are wear is perfectly even, so I'm quite sure the alignment is fine.
However, the car now is showing its age, and I am about to take it to a fairly major repair. Both axles are knocking, passenged side wheel hub is making funny noise, power steering fluid is leaking. So I figure if I am gonna spend a bunch of money on this repair, which is gonna require alignment after it anyway, I might as well try and see what is causing the steering wheel to be off-center and fix it, if its a critical problem, or just inexpensive to fix.
What should I look into? I know basic things about civic suspension, I dont know jack about rack and pinion system, the steering columnt, etc. What do you guys think is causing this problem?
Also, on a side not, whats up with civic's axles? I replaced them on my civic about 4 years ago, when it had about 75,000 on it, and now it had 118,000 and they are shot again. Shouldn't they last a little longer?
So I went back to the alignment shop and told them what happened. The guy put my car onto the alignment machine, and to my surprise the wheel alignment was perfect, just the steering wheel was off-center. Due to this fact, the guy didnt even mess with the wheel alignment, he just put the steering wheel on center, and then messed with something in the suspension until his computer said that the steering wheel was centered. The whole operation took a lot less time than a whole alignment as well.
So I hopped back into my car, and went for a ride. To my disappointment I found that after this alignment I had to hold the steering wheel about 5 degrees to the RIGHT for the car to go straight. As before, the car didnt pull to any side, and would go perfectly straight if i let go of the steering wheel while its turned about 5 degrees to the right.
I didn't go back to the alignment shop to complain, because I figured that something in the suspension must be bent and causing this abnormality. I saw the computer reading, which showed that alignment was perfect, and I saw that the steering wheel was perfectly centered during adjustment, so I figured that it must be a mechanical problem, and not alignment.
Since then (october 2003) I drove good 6,000-7,000 miles, with this steering issue. I regularly check tire wear, and the tires are wear is perfectly even, so I'm quite sure the alignment is fine.
However, the car now is showing its age, and I am about to take it to a fairly major repair. Both axles are knocking, passenged side wheel hub is making funny noise, power steering fluid is leaking. So I figure if I am gonna spend a bunch of money on this repair, which is gonna require alignment after it anyway, I might as well try and see what is causing the steering wheel to be off-center and fix it, if its a critical problem, or just inexpensive to fix.
What should I look into? I know basic things about civic suspension, I dont know jack about rack and pinion system, the steering columnt, etc. What do you guys think is causing this problem?
Also, on a side not, whats up with civic's axles? I replaced them on my civic about 4 years ago, when it had about 75,000 on it, and now it had 118,000 and they are shot again. Shouldn't they last a little longer?
03-04-2004, 07:36 PM
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How big of a pothole was it? It could have bent the frame, which that wouldn't show on the alignment rack. What was the camber readings after your alignment?
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03-04-2004, 07:58 PM
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the camber is -0.7 to -1.0, but its ok, b/c I have about 1/2-3/4" drop (ITR springs)
the pothole wasnt all that big, I doubt it could have damaged the frame. I've hit bigger potholes before, it's just that this particular one i hit during a 60 degree turn; wasn't going too fast either, maybe 25-30 or so.
the pothole wasnt all that big, I doubt it could have damaged the frame. I've hit bigger potholes before, it's just that this particular one i hit during a 60 degree turn; wasn't going too fast either, maybe 25-30 or so.
03-04-2004, 09:06 PM
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Did you get a 4-wheel alignment or just a front-end alignment? Have them check caster, toe, and camber. Something isn't lined up.
You could have blown 1 shock, but you should be able to see that on your tires (multiple flat spots around its face).
Also, there's a steering knuckle that works like a tie rod. If there's slop (if you can wiggle it at all) in that joint with both front tires off the ground, then it's bad. The same goes for ball joints. If you can move the wheels on the spindle or the suspension at all, closely inspect your ball joints and tie rods. These things wear as cars get older. If there's slop in any joint, replace that part.
Tell the next shop about the trouble you've been having, and ask them to check out the whole steering rack and suspension . Then, when you drop it off, ask if they'll test drive it when they're done to make sure it's straight, and if you can come back in a week to have it tweaked if it's off. You'll have all the guarantee you need that it will work right when they're done. Most shops will stand behind their work.
As for the axles... Buy axles with a lifetime warranty. Hondas don't have the beefiest axles. You could upgrade to a higher quality axle like www.raxles.com sells, or just stop cutting your CV boots on crap. My axle boots are both cut right now, and they're less than 7000 miles old. One picked up a plastic bag, it tightened as it stretched and sawed through the boot... Accident or not, once the boot goes, any axle will quickly start to die. When mine go, I get them warranty replaced, and I replace them myself. It takes (me) about 30 minutes to replace an axle and re-pack the front wheel bearing on a Honda. Axles are between $60 and $120 depending on the quality. They're all remanufactured. Don't fool yourself.
You could have blown 1 shock, but you should be able to see that on your tires (multiple flat spots around its face).
Also, there's a steering knuckle that works like a tie rod. If there's slop (if you can wiggle it at all) in that joint with both front tires off the ground, then it's bad. The same goes for ball joints. If you can move the wheels on the spindle or the suspension at all, closely inspect your ball joints and tie rods. These things wear as cars get older. If there's slop in any joint, replace that part.
Tell the next shop about the trouble you've been having, and ask them to check out the whole steering rack and suspension . Then, when you drop it off, ask if they'll test drive it when they're done to make sure it's straight, and if you can come back in a week to have it tweaked if it's off. You'll have all the guarantee you need that it will work right when they're done. Most shops will stand behind their work.
As for the axles... Buy axles with a lifetime warranty. Hondas don't have the beefiest axles. You could upgrade to a higher quality axle like www.raxles.com sells, or just stop cutting your CV boots on crap. My axle boots are both cut right now, and they're less than 7000 miles old. One picked up a plastic bag, it tightened as it stretched and sawed through the boot... Accident or not, once the boot goes, any axle will quickly start to die. When mine go, I get them warranty replaced, and I replace them myself. It takes (me) about 30 minutes to replace an axle and re-pack the front wheel bearing on a Honda. Axles are between $60 and $120 depending on the quality. They're all remanufactured. Don't fool yourself.
03-06-2004, 06:49 PM
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Well, I went to the mechanic today to have them check the car out, and it turned out my rack and pinion was leaking. They replaced rack and pinion but couldnt do the alignment b/c im driving on a spare (tire i need are not in stock anywhere). It was way out of my budget to replace the axels, plus they are not making much noise yet, so i think that can wait. the boots actually were not ripped, so i think the axels might last a bit more. everything else was inspected and is seemingly ok. when i finally get my tire and go for alignment, ill see what happens
by the way, what exactly is the steering knuckle, where is it located?
by the way, what exactly is the steering knuckle, where is it located?
03-07-2004, 09:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Ochdx
Well, I went to the mechanic today to have them check the car out, and it turned out my rack and pinion was leaking. They replaced rack and pinion but couldnt do the alignment b/c im driving on a spare (tire i need are not in stock anywhere). It was way out of my budget to replace the axels, plus they are not making much noise yet, so i think that can wait. the boots actually were not ripped, so i think the axels might last a bit more. everything else was inspected and is seemingly ok. when i finally get my tire and go for alignment, ill see what happens
by the way, what exactly is the steering knuckle, where is it located?
by the way, what exactly is the steering knuckle, where is it located?
I don't know if the power steering gear on a Honda is inside or outside the rack. My car doesn't have power steering so I haven't had to work around it, and I haven't had to fix a Honda rack yet and havent paid attention to that on other people's Hondas. But if it's inside the rack, and you have to replace it because it's leaking anyway, then don't worry about it. Your problem will be solved. I could look it up in AllData to see how it's set up.
I'm glad you got it checked out. At least now you know. You can just keep adding fluid as it leaks and be fine to get by for a while, but it makes a mess. As long as you don't let the pump run dry or develop any places in the turning radius that hang up, it will last a while like that.