ED9man

I've been doing the tire chalking trick and I'm finding that I'm getting the patch right to the edge and not over with almost 15 pounds more in the front than the rear. Is this normal? I do think the car feels noticeably better but it seems like such a big difference of pressure. I'm not plowing it either with understeer, which I think might throw it off, and I'm pushing the car so the rear starts to slide so I know that they are maxing out as well as the front in terms of grip. :dunno:

CivicSiRacer

What tires would help. What wheels and size. What suspension etc....

The best way to measure pressure is to use a needle pyrometer which you stick in the tire right after your run. You take temps of the inside, middle and outside tread of the front tires.

If it's even across it's perfect.
If it's hot in the middle you have too much air.
If it's hot on the shoulders you need more.

Then you adjust the rear pressures to your liking.

DakarM

should also list the actual pressures. listing just the pressure difference doesn't tell anything.

ED9man

Falken Azenis RT-615 in 195/60R14. Suspension is stock with most bushings replaced with polyurethane, alignment is was done recently factory settings. The LSD is 1.5 way clutch type and is fairly aggresive, it is a race unit. I know this is pretty much the only thing that changes the dynamics of the car significantly from stock, cuts down on understeer a lot, I think it's the reason I can make the rear slide pretty easily in faster corners. I believe I have around 38-39 in the front and something like 23-24 in the rear. I don't drive the car hard enough so that the tires get overheated or probably too much hotter than they get normally. Just a corner or two here and there on backroads I like, nothing where I can run hard for extended periods, not safe.

It almost seems to me that the pressure that is good for longer sweeping corners taken at higher speeds isn't as good for lower speed tight corners, like auto-x corners. When I purposely overinflated the rears with my old set, I liked how it felt in tight corners, it seems to be easier to get it to turn faster and not understeer, but it felt unstable and almost scary in faster sweeping corners, I had to take them slower because it felt like the back ran out of grip earlier. It almost seems like less rear grip is better from slower corners but worse for faster ones. I know in fast corners, as I push harder and am pretty smooth, usually the rear starts to let go first, but in a tight corner it's usually the front that looses grip first, it's harder to make the rear rotate, I dunno if that's a driving issue because I can do it sometimes with the same low rear pressure, it's just not as easy to do as in a faster corner. Braking for a lower speed corner is more difficult for me so maybe that's why, I tend to brake too early and not hard enough sometimes I cut in too early and don't let off the brake at the right second. I think it's harder because less time is spent braking and also when you start to brake seems harder to judge perfectly than for a higher speed corner. It's almost like with braking for a lower speed corner you're doing everything faster so it's easier to make a mistake if that makes any sense. When I do it right, it feels like the rear unloads a lot since I am on the brake hard enough and a quick cut in and a later apex makes the rear want to rotate, it just feels like the car doesn't really want to do it since it's hard to induce. I'm guessing it could be the stock suspension so overinflation in the rear compensates for that in tighter corners right? Even if it doesn't feel as good in faster ones.

Sorry if I blabbed too much or didn't make sense. h:

DakarM

repeat this mantra.

no such thing as less grip. more grip add grip, no such thing as reducing grip.

just about everything you are saying is all typical beginner mistakes. just work on them and keep attending autoxes.

ED9man

I want to attend one so bad, my parents are still not giving in for some reason. I bet I would learn so much actually going to an event as opposed to just messing around by myself and trying to figure out things on the street. My mom thinks because you have to wear a helmet there is something unsafe about it to name one of her silly reasons.

How does that mantra work?

DakarM

okay then i take back what i said. save it for the autox. you aren't figuring out shit on the street. i can tell you that much.

CivicSiRacer

I'd have to agree. If you are doing that stuff on the street SAVE it. Not worth killing yourself to find your settings on the street, plus it's not safe.

Have your mom come with you to an event and have her talk to the autocross chief. She will find that autocrossing is probably one of the safest sports to do. She probably gets her feelings from hearing all the crap on the news and all the stupid movies.

But you really are not going to figure out your settings unless you do it in a controlled environment like an autocross. There are too many factors when you try to do it on the street.

How old are your Azenis by the way? I"m guessing they are heat cycled out if they are the 215s. Meaning they are hard as rocks. This is why I get new tires every season - huge major difference between heat cycled tires and new ones.

Also just for reference sake, you always want your car comfortable. When a car is comfortable you will always drive it 10/10ths (learned this last year at NE Divisionals). I had my car setup too tail happy and I was probably driving it 8/10ths cause I was scared of it coming around. When I backed off the stiffness of the rear I started getting faster and faster.

Understeer I believe is good in a way for a car anyway cause it's easier to recover from than oversteer and worse is snap oversteer. To recover from understeer just slow down more and unwind the steering wheel, while releasing the brake pedal a bit. It's more intuitive than anything else.

ED9man

I agree with you completely, I don't want to learn on the street and it's very hard to draw solid conclusions. Comfort is definently important though, just getting my seat made a nice difference in my feeling of control since I didn't have to brace myself as much. Right now since my reach is too far I am afraid of loosing steering control, so I am getting a new wheel set up that should have better grip and most importantly bring it closer.

My parents said they'd go and check it out, but it's hard to get them to go on a 2.5 hour drive to the autocross. Hopefully I'll manage to drag one of them along. h:

My Azenis are almost brand new, probably about 2000 miles on them. They are also the 615's.