Bane2871

I'm needing to sell my beloved 330Ci (addition to the family) and am considering the Fit. However, I'm loath to give up the performance of the 330. Where is a good resource for upgrades, specifically engine. I'm trying for 150hp without forced induction or any internal engine changes. any suggestions?

Suspension upgrades are a little easier to figure out.


P.S. Does the Fit really come with drum brakes in the rear?

jaje

do you really need to sell?...young kids can get in the back easily...it is just the parents having to bend over and crawl back there to get babies in and out

spoon & mugen (or mtec) have several sport and race vehicles already fitted so there is some items starting to emerge - the aftermarket takes a little while to respond but usually within 1 year you have everything you'll need outside of major ecu work

yes it does but brakes quite well...i'm going to be selling my Element when i move this summer and will be looking at the Fit and possibly a used 190E Evo, WRX, 328is or M3 (e30 or e36 only), or civic si sedan that comes out this fall

Bane2871

Keeping the 330 is definitely an option, but the wife has a 7 year old Passat that we are looking to replace. So, we'd trade the 330 and the Passat for something like an MDX or and get a small eco-car as second ride. Though the Solstice is interesting...

But, the Fit has been doing time in Europe and Japan for many years already, so there should be a developed aftermarket, should there not? It would just be a matter of making those parts available in the States?

Drum brakes. Makes me think of the unrestored and well abused '72 Cutlass I used to drive.

The main problem with the 330 is the lack of trunk space (yard supplies, lumber, and triathlon gear take up a lot of space). I thought about the new GTI, but its pretty pricey once optioned up. On a daily basis, though, the 330 is an absolute blast to drive. Which is why I would want to upgrade the Fit (assuming I go that route).

jaje

you could get a rav4 or cr-v and get better gas mileage...suvs suck up gas...even my Element when I drive it slow and nice only can get up to 26mpg...it takes $40 to fill the tank on regular...an MDX will get you much less mpg and cost more to fill

there maybe parts overseas but that doesn't mean they are easy to get in the states...it just might mean getting them hear or others making them will get them to market sooner rather than a car than starting from complete scratch

drum brakes work well but for competition you want rear discs - which i'm sure someone will sell an upgrade kit (which i hope they do if i buy one)

i kinda like the GTI (but have several friends with 4-5 year old vw's and have lots of problems such as dead trannies, blow engines, elec problems, etc.)...Honda's always made a more reliable car, VW always a nicer looking and feeling car

the Fit will "fit" you well if you have stuff to haul...it's small but i'm guessing with $3 and even $4 gas here to stay the big suvs will make their long overdue exit in the next couple of years making the roads safer for everyone

Bane2871

you're using logic. the MDX (or similar) would be the wife's car, where appearance and style take priority. and logic? that often takes a back seat to other more inportant things, like style and appearance. hence, the Fit as an 'equalizer'.

I was thinking the same, but I've been keeping SCCA Solo II rules in the back of mind as I think about this. intake, headers, exhaust, chip, brake upgrades, etc. will put the Fit into a class with some very tough competition (where E36 M3's often rule the day). But since the Fit is small and light (with Z06 slalom speeds) it already has an advantage.

I believe the new GTI will be German built (the regular Golf being built in Mexico). Its my understanding that the Germna built VW's are very reliable (our Passat being one example) but that Mexican versions are hit and miss. Honda definitely has the reliability figured out, but there is nothing quite like the "feel" of German engineering.

jaje

men are from mars and women are from venus...yes logic and rationality go out the door on the latter planet

i'd keep it close to stock and compete against other slight to none modified cars...i find that every time i go crazy with modifications (take my 2002 Mazda protege5 wagon that i spent years and a lot of cash modifying it...suspension, intercooled turbo setup [was a prototype kit for a shop], etc.)

alot of vdub'rs have called themselves the poor man's BMW...i find that Honda more fits that bill b/c they are an engineering company that races to learn and better their product, just like BMW does...however vw is just a car company that does some racing to market their cars (just like Toyota does)...it's the corp culture of racing as a core focus that is what tends to push me towards Honda or BMW

Bane2871

Very different approach between BMW and Honda, though.

Honda = low displacement, high revving, peaky motors.
BMW = high displacement, lower revving, torquey motors.

Most Honda's are slugs below 4000 rpm, which makes them a bit frustating to drive in traffic. But, it sounds like Honda did a good job with the Fit's gearing to compensate.

One thing I did notice when watching the video from one of the other threads; inside front wheel spin is an issue. The Fit could definitely use a limited slip diff.

jaje

on this point i would beg to differ...honda engines are quite torquey when compared to engines of same size (barring forced induction)...the b16 is a great little motor but is often in a class with 1.8+ liter motors so yes it is lower in torque comparitively to the larger motors but to other n/a 1.6 liters it is quite strong

in fact other mfgrs have yet to create a true vtec copy engine (outside of the yamaha engine in the celica gts)...honda's vtec actually changes over the lobes on the camshaft where all other competitors just vary the angle of the cam or crank shafts or timing which helps but does not create the true 2 stage engine...this technology belies the fact that vtec engines have one of the flattest torque curves across a wider rpm band in comparative engine sizes...they are misnomored as peaky b/c of the extreme rev limit they can handle but they have a very good powerband well before they reach the upper reachs of the rpm range

that aside the Fit's engine was tuned differently than most other engines as it was built as a city commuter car (meaning more low end grunt) so Honda spent more time tuning for low end performance...you'll note that it doesn't have the high end willingness to rev

this could also be an issue with suspension tuning for comfort rather than all out traction

Bane2871

No trying to knock Hondas. I think they are great cars, but no car is without its flaws. Until the VTEC kicks in (at which time it feels as if another set of cylinders were engaged), Hondas seem to lack some oomph. Even the S2000 is a bit underwhelming at low RPM's.

One of the comparisons I think of is the new Civic Si versus the new GTI, though the GTI has a turbo. More low end grunt from the GTI and the Civic doesn;t come alive until well later in the RPM band.

You could be right, but the inside wheel spin was on the race prepped car.



Honda and BMW both build some of the best engines out there. You really can't lose with either.

jaje

i agree...i've always followed sorichiro honda's philosophy of do more with less

but you can't go wrong with either car...they are both well made and have good performance though through different means